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Post by CrazyBrit on Apr 8, 2015 21:10:49 GMT -8
I visited Volkstales this evening to borrow a tool from him. Whilst I was there, we got onto the subject of clutches. I was going to pm him, but figured that if I have questions about this, then perhaps others will too. And that is part of the point of having a forum, right?
My '57 bus was previously fitted with the clutch in the photo's. It was running a period, probably original 1200cc "big nut" transmission at the time. It was fitted with the flywheel in the photo's and what I believe to be a 6 volt starter, but running 12 volt electrics. The starter works fine, so could have been rebuilt to 12 volts in the past? The van is 58 years old after all and I have only owned it for 13 of those.
I am now reinstalling the original transmission after a period of running a straight axle kit and am trying to get the right bits in there to work with this transmission and hopefully last a reasonable length of time. The clutch plate that I have is 200mm in diameter and the clutch does have the ring on the pressure plate, which I now know is required for the gearbox and throw out bearing that I have. I think that this means that it is a 1967 - 1970 clutch. The flywheel is the one that came with my bus, which has been cleaned up and balanced. I thought it was the original, but as I said before, the bus is 58 years old.
I could grind out the bell housing to move up to a 12 volt flywheel, but the material seems very thin and there will be very little clearance between the flywheel and the bellhousing - somewhere around 1mm.
So my question is, what do I have and what is the best thing to do? My clutch is nearly new, so I would rather not spend more money on a new one to throw this one away. As it measures 200mm, I believe that it may be the correct one for this application, but that then begs the question of whether the flywheel is original or not, although so long as it works, it doesn't really matter!
Help please? Attachments:
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Post by stude on Apr 9, 2015 6:08:48 GMT -8
A 6 volt starter would not work on a 12 volt flywheel but a 6 volt starter works great on 12 volts and 6 volt flywheel your oe motor would have been 36hp which are expensive to convert to 12 volt so your motor must be newer one with removable generator stand 12 volt flywheels don't fit 36hp or 40hp motors but 6 volt flywheel will fit 1600cc motors your putting in a 1600cc motor in so either put a 6 volt flywheel on it or grind out the bellhousing like everyone doing this conversion and use a 12 volt flywheel your 200mm new clutch won't fit the 180mm flywheel your transmission would have been one of those non syncro types but I would think they have the clearance to grind just like the newer syncro 6 volt transmissions you would also need the starter bushing to match transmission to starter.
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Post by stude on Apr 9, 2015 6:56:50 GMT -8
I going to guess but I would say that flywheel is 180mm and but not a 36hp flywheel 180mm your bus came with your motor was ? not oe and converted to 12 volt with 6 volt starter also 36hp flywheel would not work on the 1600cc motor. Terry
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Post by CrazyBrit on Apr 9, 2015 8:11:29 GMT -8
Thanks Terry. Strangely the 200mm clutch does fit the flywheel that the bus came with. The friction face of the flywheel measures 200mm in diameter and it has 109 teeth, so it appears that this is a later 6 volt flywheel. It looks like the bellhousing may have already been clearanced for a larger than stock flywheel. The motor that I have is a twin port 1600cc with separate generator stand. The OE motor was long gone before I bought the bus. Ostensibly, everything seems to fit together. I just don't want to get the engine all bolted up to find that something is amiss! Attachments:
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Post by CrazyBrit on Apr 9, 2015 8:26:34 GMT -8
My flywheel is something like this. Did VW make such a thing, or does my bus have a bit from something a little more exotic bolted into it...??
www.cip1.ca/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=ACC%2DC20%2D5105
I had mine drilled for 8 dowels a few years ago, when I was going to fit it onto an 8 dowel motor. It was originally 4 dowels. It was also machined and balanced, which is why it looks like new. Attachments:
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Post by stude on Apr 9, 2015 8:27:34 GMT -8
The clutch plate may fit inside the flywheel but not properly clutch plates are the least expensive part that transmission has not been ground down for larger flywheel what you see is factory. Does your 1600 come with flywheel and pressure plate or is this what you have if you use this you need to use the paper or metal gasket and the 3 shims to set your end play rather than o-ring and 3 shims I have the gasket if you need one also heat riser block off if you need. Following link has good info. Terry www.thebugshop.org/bsfq12v6.htm
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Post by stude on Apr 9, 2015 8:40:02 GMT -8
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Post by stude on Apr 9, 2015 8:45:17 GMT -8
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Post by CrazyBrit on Apr 9, 2015 8:52:03 GMT -8
Yes, the flywheel and clutch were in the bus with the same engine that I am planning to install, when I brought it to Canada. Everything worked fine. However, when I spoke with Volkstales he suggested that I may have some slipping and longevity issues with a 180mm clutch. When I got home I measured the clutch and discovered that it was actually a 200mm unit. The clutch only has a couple of thousand miles on it so should be good for a lot more.
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Post by stude on Apr 9, 2015 9:11:11 GMT -8
Ok so what you are saying is you have a 6 volt 109 tooth flywheel opened up to for a 200mm clutch so what is the pressure plate? T
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Post by stude on Apr 9, 2015 9:15:57 GMT -8
Does it have an o-ring that would make it exotic. T
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Post by stude on Apr 9, 2015 9:56:45 GMT -8
If your motor was based on a 66 1300cc that flywheel may be oe but the oe crank for that motor gets turned down the next year or so to accept the o-ring so I am not sure if a 12 volt flywheel would fit an 66 oe crank. T
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Post by CrazyBrit on Apr 9, 2015 10:09:33 GMT -8
There is no o-ring at present, however the 6 volt flywheel has a recess machined into the front. It is the shiny one in the pictures The rusty one is a 12 volt, circa 1969. Attachments:
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Post by stude on Apr 9, 2015 10:45:14 GMT -8
If you have a 12 volt see if it fits.
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Post by CrazyBrit on Apr 9, 2015 19:18:45 GMT -8
The 12v flywheel doesn't fit. I would need to start grinding the bellhousing and I am not really keen on doing that. I think that I am going to go with the 6 volt flywheel that I have and the 200mm clutch. They appear to be compatible with each other and the gearbox, and have been installed in the vehicle previously. The next question is, should I try installing an o-ring in the machined recess on the flywheel, or should I be going for the stock paper gasket - or both? The manual that I have refers to using a sealant / adhesive on the o-ring. I read online that a good quality silicone works well. Any advice? Attachments:
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